The average life of these timing chains is 90,000 miles or 9 years. 20. Usually, you will need to service the chain between 120,000 and 200,000 miles to ensure it won't make any problems. The only dumb question is the unasked question! It is not the same rattle. 21. NOTE: Be careful not to scratch or damage the camshaft. it's not vanos, which rattles differently (had extreme vanos rattle with my M50), which has also been rebuilt. It's hard to predict when the chain may break or jump once it started rattling. I initially thought I had some sort of timing chain issue (and that may still be the source of the noise given the history of this motor). check out the. This problem becomes more pronounced on cold weather mornings when the oil is thicker and on high-mileage 3.5L EcoBoost engines. BMW use timing chains in almost every model of engine that they produce. Unless there is a specific fault, the timing chain should be replaced between 80,000 and 120,000 miles. 36. Ive had an extremely bad run with Chevy/GMC products where their variable valve timing and active fuel management issues have nearly bankrupted me in head, lifter, and timing chain repairs. While the compressed air is being applied, rotate the actuator by hand to the unlocked position. The audio is from my 2012 sprinter engine start up at 90k, timing chain had stretched. Do not Attempt!AMAZON ASSOCIATES DISCLOSUREAuto Repair Guys is a participant in the Amazon Services LLC Associates Program, an affiliate advertising program designed to provide a means for sites to earn advertising fees by advertising and linking to Amazon.com*DisclaimerWe, Auto Repair Guys, are not responsible for property damage or injury incurred as a result of any of the information contained in this video. Table of Contents show I just bought this truck a few months ago, and it's driven by a friend. Your vehicles timing chain is a critical component. Have checked forums and found answers regarding cold start up and timing chains etc. In the mean time, turn the key to the start position, wait 10 seconds, start it, let it idle for a minute or two before you drive. Pretty sure it's mecanical. full of oil when engine is off. 19. 32. When you purchase through links on our site, we may earn an affiliate commission, which supports our community. It sounds like a timing chain slap/rattle. OP, did you replace the $5.00 valve in the oil filter cap? Others have postured that it is an exhaust leak. Rotate the crankshaft clockwise to top dead center (TDC) No. Excess slack in the timing chain can cause a rattling sound or even a clanking sound if the slack is severe enough to cause the chain to contact the timing chain cover. But my parents 14 T3 TDI has started having the rattle on startup. So I have a chatter on cold start. A dealer of Chevy or Ford, for example, should do it for $600 to $900 depending on the model and the type of your engine. Then give a sharp jolt diagonally downwards to release the tensioner. BMW says the timing chains on the the N63 have been found to been found to stretch and wear out prematurely, resulting in premature valvetrain wear and reduced engine performance., The engine timing chain and oil pump drive chain module limited warranty extension to 7 years/70,000 miles (as determined by the vehicles original in-service date) for defects in material and workmanship applies to eligible US-specification BMW vehicles that are registered, operated, and have their covered repair . Analytical cookies are used to understand how visitors interact with the website. have a rattle on start up of engine. Required fields are marked *. It's not going to hurt the car if it's something mechanical, since warranty repairs and all that. - Aging Plastic Intake Components May Cause Leaks, - Diagnosing Intercooler Boost Trouble Code P0299, Alternator Testing For No Charge Conditions, Misfire Codes P0300, P0301-P0312 and P0313+P0314, The February Digital Edition Is Free To Download, Read, The January Digital Edition Is Available To Download, Read, Read Your Copy of Decembers ShopOwner Now, The November Digital Edition Is Available To Download, Read, Why Alternators Are Subject To Ripple Voltage. Have an assistant hold the camshaft/VTC actuator assembly steady on the padded workbench with an open-end wrench. After the truck has sat overnight, that oil moves down to the bottom of the oil pan, forcing the cam phasers to start without enough lubrication. For the more educated, it sounds like an aggressive overhead cam rattle. Completed my timing chain rattle slap on cold start-up job. Following adjustments, use a tappet locknut wrench to torque the locknuts. But if the chain is stretched would it not rattle every cold start up ? OEMs consider the spark plugs a part of the emissions system on most modern vehicles. What happens when BMW timing chain breaks? Sure enough, the timing chain was actually loose. But we don't recommend this because we've seen some people having to deal with the consequences of this. The cost of labor depends on the chosen shop. Since oil is the magical cure, a lot of folks are now installing aftermarket pre-oilers to their high-mileage Ford engines. Check the valve cover gasket. This cookie is set by GDPR Cookie Consent plugin. Would like to do that test myself. On a scale of 1-10, it's a 2 for me. The possible cause could be the variable valve timing control (VTC) actuator is defective. Its cost around 1000 to 1500 to fix a timing chain. that is normal Every V6 that has multiple timing chains under the front cover make this noise. Replaced: primary timing chain, secondary timing chains, exhaust and intake phasers, main timing chain tensioner, every gasket/o-ring/seal in the process following FordTechMakuloco's 4-Part Youtube videos. If the valve is not working or a filter without anti flow back valve is installed, the top parts of the engine may be starved for oil for a few seconds at start-up. Then lift your foot off the gas and start the car normally. But opting out of some of these cookies may affect your browsing experience. You could try using a thicker oil like 10W40 to reduce the noise. Apply engine oil to the journals and caps for both camshafts. If so any issues from the dealer? Something you don't really want unless it's unavoidable. Check the valve clearance using a tappet adjuster. Cadillac Forums is the perfect place to go to talk about your favorite Caddys including the ATS, CTS, SRX and Escalade. So, investing in such a vehicle is not always right. If you guys find this mildly annoying. One is a rattle on startup. Recommended Services. Understanding Engine Timing Chains, Gears and Belts, GM Tech Tip: New Engine Noise During Cold Start-Up. Wait 30 minutes before adding oil (if needed). Don't give up. 1 cylinder. in the current automotive and consumer climate in america, that's certainly not the norm or to be expected, i think you're headed in the right direction to inquire with Subaru and see what happens. "This engine has duel overhead cams with hydraulic valve lash adjusters, and hydraulically tensioned timing chains, all of which CAN make noise on startup, again no harm to any parts. Ford Expeditions commonly reach 215,000 miles. It was NOT the higher pitched rattle of the wastegates. The valves themselves will bend and potentially ruin the engine. Right now in the Midwest, there are 3 for sale with over 200,000 miles and one of those is a 2008 model with 226,000 miles on it. Plus I know someone else that just had their timing chains/tensioners replaced on their T3 TDI under warranty and it rattles . Thought it fixed . If the new VTC actuator is unlocked after installation on the camshaft, go to step 28. When installed and rotated this way the VTC actuator will not lock. :lildevil: Very true I trust myself with doing these chains since I've done 9 since last October but its getting redundant that's too many just around ft. What we know is that a lot of Ecoboost owners are complaining about the same rattle. I know you guys that are Subaru peeps (sounds like Carl is dealer affiliated somehow?) Welcome to the Subaru Outback Owners Forum, we have tons of information about your Subaru Outback, from a Subaru Outback Wiki to customer reviews. To make a long story short, two of the . 7. I would hate to see how you function in daily life. Engines need perfect timing for optimal work. Some Ford vehicles equipped with a 4.6L 3-valve or 5.4L 3-valve engine may exhibit a ticking and/or knocking noise after reaching normal operating temperature, or a rattle upon starting. The motor may also lack accelerating power. Wear and tear will eventually mean the chain must be replaced and hearing a rattling from the engine is a good sign that your belt is about to break. The average cost to replace timing chain tensioner is around US$1000 to US$1600. Car won't start. Apply clean engine oil to the mounting bolt threads, then install the mounting bolt, finger tighten. If the dealer installed the chain and a problem recurs, clearly it was not done right. in the future a redesign could be available that could fix the issue if enough customers complained of the noise and subaru decided if it is worth there time. Your motor was engineered to consume regular diesel only. If I have to do them again they are easy to do just irritated lol. over time, chains stretch a little and this provides them with the opportunity to be louder than they usually are; when a chain is stretched, it can hit the plastic shoe that is used to direct it in the timing system; also, the stretched chain will hit other parts of the engine including metal parts and this will sometimes create bad rattling; when the chain is cold, it can be OK, but after warming up, it may start rattling because after this it stretches even more; of course, the tensioner is there to help solve this problem and rattling can only occur when the tensioner is no longer capable of keeping the chain in optimal condition; when the chain is too stretched, it can just jump and change its position which will have bad consequences for the engine. 43. Advertisement cookies are used to provide visitors with relevant ads and marketing campaigns. How much does it cost to fix a BMW timing chain? 33. All Rights Reserved. Why do timing chains make a rattling noise? For the more educated, it sounds like an aggressive overhead cam rattle. If the cassettes (guides) are worn, there is no helping the situation without remove and replace of the timing set (R&R). Almost any BMW has the potential to run for up to 200,000 or even 250,000 miles with proper maintenanceand there are always going to be outliers that go further. The minimal kit is a chain, a tensioner, some bearings, a water pump, plastic shoes, and also some other small parts that may be needed in the process of replacement. Im the same way. This is causing many people to switch back to the original programming under the 21N08 program. A broken timing chain will cause an engine to not start or fail while driving. :grin2:. The explanation is simple - you never know what went wrong. Well, there is no average rule on the life expectancy of timing chains. Suspected timing chain problem. We believe timing chains are a little better than belts because they usually start rattling long before they break or jump. Is been less than 6k miles since I did the timing chains. No. I've scoured the forums and can't find hardly anyone that gets this like I do. A forum community dedicated to BMW E46, E90, and F30 owners and enthusiasts. For a better experience, please enable JavaScript in your browser before proceeding. Once tted, with the actuator facing you, carefully rotate it counterclockwise until it engages the camshaft locator pin. Place to go to talk about your favorite Caddys including the ATS, CTS SRX... It rattles Caddys including the ATS, CTS, SRX and Escalade, SRX and.! But if the dealer installed the chain between 120,000 and 200,000 miles to ensure it wo n't make problems... N'T recommend this because we 've seen some people having to deal with the actuator by hand to original. It rattles the locknuts BMW E46, E90, and F30 owners enthusiasts! 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Something mechanical, since warranty repairs and all that the timing chains a... Recommend this because we 've seen some people having to deal with the website under and! If I have to do just irritated lol understanding engine timing chains etc to the programming!